digibutter.nerr

[Zelnor]

The economy is dead, long live the economy !

I have prepared a diagram on which I've noted down the issues and how to fix them, and since the old topic died I'll repost and explain it here.

Lol Diagram.


So, yeah, basically the issue is that money needs to flow. We, however, have an infinite supply of money - whenever we post, a magical, franis-shaped demon spits out a coin somewhere, and that buggers the concept of economy right up the ass.

Zelnor's Robin Hood Economy

Rule 1: Inverse proportions rule our economy - a.k.a. the more you have the less you get.
There is a strong anti-rich sentiment in Digibutter, aparently because those who are rich stay it and the others don't. Coins, whilst practically worthless, appear to be Digibutters' lustrous E-peen equivalent, and whilst tthere's an infinite supply you apparently never have enough.
The first step to alleviate this is to put everything into proportion. Inverse proportions, that is. This way, a newbie could rack up coins easily and get a starting capital to use, whilst the rich people would earn lower and spend their money to make some again. Of course, in order to keep the flow, we need to invent subdynamics so that nobody just puts everything into items to get moar coins again. So, therefore...
We need a total value for each member. What they have in the bank, what coins they have, their items, their usershop earning - this all determines their total "Have", which determines any multipliers to their gains. So, if you have very little, you'll get a bonus to your earnings, whilst the rich and wealthy receive less money from what they do. That would establish a little bit of fairness.

Of course, this is a fictional economy, so we're free to experiment.


And now... Zelnor's Step-by-Step guide to fixing the economy

Step No. 1: Limit the supply to raise the demand.
If we have an infinite supply of money, it isn't special. Even though we use a fictional currency that isn't backed by anything, it's worth even less since we're basically having constant inflation. By limiting the amount of money, we gently force people to circulate it so it will come back to them.

Therefore, I'd say that we limit the total money in the system to either X coins per member (but they can, of course, be circulated; 999 [Maximum ?] per member would be a nice Mario reference ) or a total value, like 1.000.000 coins.
To ensure circulation, we have to pick off any "dead ends" in the flow, e.g. the non-user shops, arcade, etc. We could establish a MeowBot that gives us a "paycheck" for duties and jobs (which would be a way to make a non-user controlled title to give us some variety, this could also be implemented into the Fort Francis RP board; liike "Janitor", "Cook", etc. ), or we get birthday presents from it, etc.
However, this would make the item situation somewhat insecure, as we'd have to keep making items which vanish after use; so it is crucial to keep the coins circulating or else they're all "in" items that disappear after use.


Step 2: Suck overdue money out of the system.
We need to establish "coinsinks", something that costs a lot and provides little service, to get money that goes over the limit out of the system. Once again, whether we limit the number of coins or keep the magical out-of-nowhere coins, there needs to be a limit to make them worth something.
I think we could make a Forum called Golden Saucer, or Mimi's Mansion, where posts don't give coins, but cost coins. That would suck money out, give the rich people a place to be rich (*tips golden top hat*) and limit the moeny in the system, either until we're in the limit (as simply, taking away the rich people's coins in a "New Deal" would be unnecessarily upsetting) or to blow off excess coins from infinite spawns.

I have a maths class now, I'll go on later.

[Celeste Dimentia]

I like your ideas, and I bestow your post with what I think is a properly earned cookie for the thought that went into it. I may give some more responsive feedback later, when I don't have a headache. xD

[Zelnor]

Very good. Now lean back and enjoy the show, I'm only getting started !

I am full of tea and chocolate, have lunch break and a free lesson and my MP-Player is playing the Genie's song on loop. And Gandrayda's Theme *cracks Knuckles*

I left off at the idea of A) Setting the total amount in the system to a fixed value, either a total or a dynamic coins-per-member basis, B) Following that with sucking any money over the limit, and potentially money from people with lots of it, out of the system by introducing coinsinks in the form of "premium" content, i.e. a forum where you pay-per-post (fancy golden color scheme, Tippi replaced by that golden Bob-Omb / Flavio and fancy cursive script instead of ol' Arial etc. included).

Further ideas for coinsinks:

- Custom usertitle / second usertitle (cannot be changed, only be removed and then re-bought)

- Sparkly / Italicized / Underlined username (Generally, we should automatically bold and / or italicize the names of the mods, so we can identify them even with a new name or something. I don't want to create an even greater class hierachy, but some distinct feature might improve respect and/or acknowledgement of the mods)

- Custom font(s). Upload a .tiff or other font file and make your posts distinct from the masses !

High-octane Ideas - HANDLE WITH CARE:
- Bail (Pay to reduce your jail sentence, but a) only to a certain minimum so there's still a punishment,and b) the more coins you have, the more you'll have to pay to reduce the sentence )
- MeowMeeps: Sorta like Tamagotchis; you buy an egg and breed and raise them, feed them, and hope to get the ultra rare golden MeowMeep. They're fluffy and cuddle and animated. </Cloudcuckooland>

... I kinda lost my track of thought here. Anyway, the greatest challenge is to keep the cash flowing, and I have just the plan.

What we need is the Glitz Pit. An organized tournament with ranks. It would give purpose to coins, give new meaning to the HP / MP and battle system, and be a better sort of leaderboard then mere coins.

Each weekend, you can challenge someone one rank above you (initial ranks determined randomly) and be challenged by those below you. Depending on how far up you are, you have a greater or lower percentage / amount of your coins you're allowed to use, and then the battle is logged and on like King Kong. Battle Logs can be seen in the Hall of records; meybe we could touch them up a little, e.g. displaying *Avatar*: Message / Item
Effect
*Other person's Avatar*: Counter, Taunt, Item

etc.

Also, as a last shot, newbies and the poor should get a few percent off at the stores, and maybe we could re-introduce bank interest with a percentage inversely proportional to what you have, but at least 5 % every week.

More ideas later; stick a fork in me, I'm done for the moment.

[Captain Blue]

Seto Kaiba of Kaiba Corporation here. I'm expecting two of your richest members to complain about this very soon. Their excuses will be more or less "Screw you, I'm staying the richest." Seeing as I could go on all day about your first post only to get striked for it, let me go down the list of perks in your second post instead.

Custom user title: Meh. Not like that's going to change much

Sparkly/Italicized/Underlined name: Is that the best you can do? Why not just make their name gold on the memberlist?

Custom font: Okay that's just *EFF*ing stupid. The first thing someone will do is upload the wingdings font and start using that all day. Not to mention the fact that not all fonts are web-friendly, and uploading a file could mean they can upload a virus into digi.

Bail: Didn't Ulti already say he opposes this idea, and the general consensus was go with Ulti? Saying ("Screw the rules, I have money." This idea isn't too bad...)

Meowmeeps: That's just....this is the worst idea of the lot, because the moment someone gets a gold one they're going to flaunt it, then everyone's going to start getting gold meowmeeps and it will be virtually worthless. Overall a waste of bandwidth. Seaman kicks the crap out of Tamagotchi anyway.

Glitz Pit: What if people don't want to be a part of this? Do they have to be at the bottom at all times? That'll hurt their self-esteem, and we all know everyone here has such low self-esteem that a single tap to it makes them burst into tears and/or rage. If you want to create more flamewars, go ahead. Let this come into fruition, Francis.

Overall, your perks are insignificant and, to the rich members, not worth giving up coins for. Plus you keep forgetting one thing: Gold Bars can completely screw over your bank interest idea. Seto Kaiba out.

[Frozenwinters]

The newb multiplier verse the rich multiplier is also a screwed up idea. What if the rich member makes TONS of totally on topic posts outside of the OTs? What they only get 3 coins? Whereas the noob (Who probably isn't posting anything intelligent or on topic) would get 3 coins per post? FLAWED. VERY, VERY FLAWED.

[Launching Star]

[Zelnor]

Response tiem, as I seem to be bad at articulating my idea.

[Captain Blue]

Again, sorry if I came off as destructive. I just had an urge to try what I had planned, but my ideas are virtually the same. I come off as destructive all the time, though, because I decide on blunt wording. It's no excuse, but it is good to know that despite my blunt criticisms, I am simply trying to point out, from my point of view, what is wrong with the idea. Then again, I tend to dislike new ideas, so a bit of bias tends to happen as well. Anyway, still don't support it, but it's Francis' decision overall. If he chooses this and chaos erupts, don't blame me. If he chooses this and paradise ensues, don't rub my nose into the dirt.

Oh, and the bit about names being gold on the memberlist was serious. Mods have dark green, Francis has orange, and rich members may have gold. Anyway, good luck....not that you'll need it with the virtual wave of positive support you're getting.

[Zelnor]

Yeah. I only recently read your new "Gonne be really IC" topic, so now I can see your response in a different light.

Well, should I copypasta this into a PM to Francis and Cid, or are there any more suggestions ?

[Francis]

I agree with your assessment.

New members don't have many coins, but they are the ones who want to spend the most. Old members have tons of coins because they are so active, but don't care to spend them.

I don't want to put a cap on the economy, or on what people can earn, but how about I don't reward coins for posts if you have over 1000 post count. Rewarding posts is to encourage posting, but if you post all the time, rewarding it isn't accomplishing anything because you would post regardless. It should shift to rewarding post-quality.

And of course, we continually need things to spend coins on at all levels of wealth. At high prices, there should be things that grant you more control (like shops, private groups, or maybe having your own room in Fort Francis)

[Captain Blue]

1000? Are you mad? That won't change the gap at all. It'll just mean that the economy will stay exactly where it is and nobody can get any more coins. People still won't buy anything, and you can't force people to lose coins. If everyone can only have 1000 coins, then there's no point to the palace. Let me consider the perks again as well...

Shops: We already have shops. Nobody buys from them. That's the problem.

Private Groups: ANYONE can have a private group.

Your own room at fort francis: Fort Francis is not concrete and ANYONE can have a room because they can just make a post where the topic title is their room.

Point is, your rewards are pointless, and taking them away from others so the rich can have them will do nothing.

Also, I know you dislike me for my negativity, Francis, but my opinions are valid, and you have no reason to disregard them.

[Super Maiq the Liar]

M'aiq agrees with Kaiba, Francis. That doesn't seem like a good idea.

Shops are rarely used as they are, and people already have the lowest possible cost for -99HP items and stuff. How would that help new people get started? It's like you give them $25,000 and tell them to start a restaraunt that would topple McDonalds. It would make people want to spend less, and the money that is spent is likely to go to one of those super-shops.

[Francis]

[Captain Blue]

Listen, chameleon. What part of "Your idea won't work." don't you understand? There's no way to beat Ultimario Mart's prices. You're only going to make the rich richer because they're the only ones who can gain profit from stores because only they can stock powerful items that people will actually buy. You're thinking this problem is far more manageable than it really is, and that will be your plan's downfall.

[Dark Prognosticus]