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[Anti-Guy]

...This is a quote from a ...'friend'...
...I used to often talk with him on a different forum, and our views often didn't agree...
...let's call my friend Olimar...

[Geno]

Wow. I must say... That was really deep. I actually agree with what he's saying. He knows what he's taking about, and he backed it up wonderfully.

As for cheating... I dunno... I don't have a view, unless it's me that is being cheated. Then, it's a no-no.

[Anti-Guy]

[Shrowser]

Olimar... Is that Olimar from Pikmin Returns? It sounds like him...

Anyways, yeah, he said everything I was just thinking. We all cheat and lie, but usually with good intentions.

[Lord Bob]

First, in the beginning, he takes a line from Karl Marx. That's not actually true.
Also, in the U.S.'s society, we ARE allowed to be against the choices of the government. It's in the *crag* constitution.
That's all I really have to comment on.

[Typhoon™]

I have no argument.
I agree 100%

[Captain Blue]

I have to agree. I steal small worthless things every day. A little extra food at lunch, for example. I've cheated my way through my 3rd period class by secretly looking at the list of answers on the review of a test while I take said test. I've even performed a lecherous action or two at school and got away with it by making up a good excuse. The point is, if nobody is harmed, and you know you can get away with it, then do it. If you're going to cheat or steal, be good at what you do so nobody is the wiser.

[Goron Mask]

You know I always thought this way for a long time, I'm glad to see someone has the same opinions I do.

[Mana7]

I read this when i was still in jail and had an argument against it, i cant remember what it was though, something about the morals of our society and that just because nobody gets hurt doesnt mean its illegal, ah well screw it i dont care that much too put effort into it

[Zelnor]

There is always a victim. Minimization, if not obliteration, of victims, exploitation, etc. are first priority.
I also disagree with the notion of "The Man" or that everyone is out to get you. I may be idealistic to a fault - and I know many companies, etc. out there live only for their own profit without concern for future generations etc. - but it gives me a more positive outlook on life and enables me to go on easier by thinking positively of my contemporaries.

Altruism without a cause.

I also find some logical fallacies in his arguments, but I think discussing the validity / argumentation of his statement wouldn't be appreciated at the moment; especially since I just "outed" myself as against what seems to be popular.

Have a nice day !

----

EDIT: Seeing as there are some others who disagree - and even if they don't, I realize, I'd just excuse myself and go into full-blown “bystander syndrome”.


This will be very long, as I will try to analyze and counterargument many of his statements. I ask of your to stick with me to the end, and to think about my arguments before denying them. I am open to suggestions and counter-arguments; I am only human and therefore I may be completely wrong. I would appreciate if any flaws in my arguments, such as logical fallacies (look it up on Wikipedia if the term is unfamiliar, there’s a link somewhere here later), could be pointed out as I am trying to improve it.



Here is my statement, or rather, my hypothesis:

I think that he is completely wrong, from my standpoint, and I will try to argue logically and empirically, not to turn you to my viewpoint, but to present an alternative way and possibly an analysis. I will provide my thoughts on the spot as I read through it again; I may jump a little but I hope I am coherent.
I apologize if I start talking as if I swallowed a dictionary or look like a pretender; I am just trying to argue as logically as possible and find it easier to go into mental “high gear” by talking “science-y”. I think I have another “disclaimer” farther down my post; I copied this into Word for spellchecking and easier editing so I might make a few little time-jumps.
First of all, from the use of a line from Karl Marx and the general ideology presented here, I assume that he is a supporter of communism, possibly with a hint of anarchy mixed in. He uses the concept of "The Man", which, however, is part of hippie or anti-establishment culture, and states his belief that all our troubles are caused by our capitalistic society.
I, personally, know of no other system that until now has worked. Of course there are flaws, but there are also opportunities. We are living in a capitalistic-socialistic society, because we tried the other models, and they didn't work.

Humans are a diverse species. From the very bottom of our existence, our genes, to our personality, style, views, etc. everyone is completely unique. It is nearly impossible to unify such a broad mass into something approaching equality, and it will always be. And whilst there are things or functions we can balance, as we do through social services, education, etc. there are some things, such as those traits defined by genetics, be it strength or intelligence, that we cannot unify, and if we did, we might end up in worlds like Harrison Bergeron( where everyone with excess creativity, intelligence, strength, etc. is forcibly altered to make them equal, which doesn't work) (the main character is a boy forced to wear heavy weights to compensate for his superior strength, all that carrying makes him even stronger and they keep increasing the weights to keep him down), 1984 (totalitarian surveillance nightmare) or Animal Farm (everyone should have read it.).

Back onto topic, there is of course a gap between rich and poor, and some "deserve" their positions, others do not. That is admittedly the major drawback of our society; the American Dream is dead and only those who got it first still have it, the others often left behind.
1. However, there is still opportunity, and at least social servic es to assist those in need.
2. Governments are elected by the people who trust them, and are bound by their own rules. In many states the power lies with the people, in differing amounts of passiveness - Americans vote for an Electoral College, we vote directly for our candidates, etc. etc.

This is also the point where I see the first logical fallacy, an "argumentum ad terrorem", an argument at fear.
[quote=“en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallacy“]A fallacy is a component of an argument which, being demonstrably flawed in its logic or form, renders the whole argument invalid (except in the case of 'begging the question' fallacy)[/quote]

[Mana7]

Oh my god *crag* brilliant up there, I wish i could applaud you over the internet.

[BAMFing ARCHER]

Zelnor's post there was really deep there, and he covered what I thought.

Now, there are two relevant ideas that my parents have taught me.

1) Every action has a consequence
2) Cheating never helps.

I've observed the second one time, and time again. I've paid innumerable consequences for cheating. I'm going to admit: I've cheated a lot. However, is it right? Should I ever cheat again to gain the upper hand?

The answer I have is "No." Why? I was also taught that there are two basic ways to do anything. The right way, and the wrong way. It may come as simple as adding correctly, as opposed to subtracting in a math problem, or the decision between admitting to your mistakes, or cheat yourself and lie, eventually doing more harm to yourself than you thought you would.

The world is not fair. However, just because others do so, do not commit acts that go against your morals as much as possible. Of course, if you think that cheating is perfectly justified, then just ignore this, since it's your thoughts, and there's no way I can change that.

[LudwigVonKoopa]

Cheating on a test?

Utter *crag* bullshit.

Taking one flash drive in a box of dozens right in front of you?

Awesome.

I daresay, if it's a dickish company not being fair, take the stuff to make up for it.

School is not to be *crag* with.

[Anti-Guy]

[Ligador]

It's my ramble time.

Selfishness is beyond control. It's not like we always act on our own profit, but, usually, when we don't, it's for the heck of making ourselves feel nice. Sometimes, even bragging rights ("Look at me, I donate $5 to charity every six months, I'm awesome").

But, everything that has been said so far runs on one assumption -- selfishness is bad. But is it, really? If humans were kind, they would have never gotten to the place where we are. We are animals, as much as every other animal. Before we developed writing and society, we had to live just like them. Under the power of a selective and cruel nature that set the one rule nobody managed to break before we did: survival of the fittest.

If cavemen were kind, what would they do if a sabertiger came chasing them up? Would they just say "Oh, he's probably hungry, I'll feed him my body"? Let's not forget cavemen did not have access to advanced medicine like modern men do.

The reason why mankind made it through the rule of survival of the fittest was because of the amount of sucker punches we delivered. We aren't as strong as those sabertigers that get all the prey, so what do we do? We steal. We steal the prey. Nowadays we say stealing is wrong, but when we say that, we're saying that all the progress amkind made -- was wrong. Let's not forget we developed crafting abilities just to beat the hell out of those hyenas and eventually larger animals with more meat. If I made myself a gun just to shoot anyone that annoys me, you would find that wrong, wouldn't you?

I do realize we don't live in prehistory anymore. But the very reason why we don't is because we cheated. Because we were selfish. So, is selfishness really wrong? Nope.

Even nowadays, we practice countless selfish actions, and we redeem ourselves not considering them selfish. Why the hell are you having dinner tonight? Why aren't you going to give allt he food in your house to some hobo out there? And why not your money, too? Because you need it to let yourself live. Because you are too selfish to give up on what YOU need to have somebody else get what THEY need.

Still, though, I disagree with some degrees of selfishness. In the world in which we live, there are all kinds of cheaters. Robbers, blackmailers, people who study the human brain just to hypnotize masses. And the reason why they are out there is because we fail at stopping them. They have found ways to break through us. Robbers don't fear death like we do. Blackmailers can find our weaknesses which we are too weak to face. And the latter kind does everything in secret and uses more brain tricks to make it look like no brain tricks are being used and everything they say is true.

Nobody can deny anymore that society is screwed up. And the reason is that we are pansies. We have too many weaknesses, and the "cheaters at life" are not exactly cheaters, they are people who know how to pick on our flaws. These people usually have ruined countless things just for the smallest kind of profit possible. It's this degree of selfishness that is not acceptable.

Our governments are full of weak people and cheaters, as well. And that's why these governments have so many problems. They can't handle cheaters. We let weak people rule, and this allows cheaters to control the rulers. The world is on the hands of the cheaters.

But, the solution to it all isn't becoming a cheater. It isn't playing just like them. First of all, they usually are born with their abilities, unlike us, so we can't beat them. Second, there is a much easier way to beat cheaters. They have a weakpoint -- they rely too much on the society's weakpoints. If the society's weakpoints were killed off, though, cheaters wouldn't have a way to keep cheating. Robbers rely on the fear people have of being shot. Blackmailers rely on finding secrets and on how people are afraid of having them revealed. People who use brain tricks rely on the excuse of there is no law agasinst it.

That's all.